[p2p-hackers] [i2p] starting a dialog of anonymous interface to i2p (fwd from kirk@wits-end.braille.uwo.ca)

Eugen Leitl eugen at leitl.org
Wed Sep 22 11:59:29 UTC 2004

----- Forwarded message from Kirk Reiser <kirk at wits-end.braille.uwo.ca> -----

From: Kirk Reiser <kirk at wits-end.braille.uwo.ca>
Date: 22 Sep 2004 07:53:40 -0400
To: i2p at i2p.net
Subject: [i2p] starting a dialog of anonymous interface to i2p
User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3

Hello everyone: I have been interested lately in the ability to pass
mail into and out of i2p to the rest of the world.  In my musings I
realize that the problem is exactly the same for many other ip
applications not just mail.  I wish I had a good answer or even one
which would work reliably even if it wasn't particularly good but I
haven't been able to think of anything which would work consistently.
I am not interested in probabilities of legal protection such as is
covered by phrases like "plausible deniability."  It seems we must find
some thing which will provide absolute anonymity whatever level of
protection that is if we want general acceptance of i2p before we've
supplanted the entire Internet.

The outgoing problem is that in the general IP world one IP address
talks to another address to pass information on various ports.  The
originating address is normally traceable if a router log fairly close
to the source can be obtained.  In the case of i2p that might not
trace back to the actual source of the packets but it is traceable to
the machine which made the outgoing connection from i2p.

It seems to me that incoming traffic is basically the same problem
once the information is in i2p it is probably going to be anonymous in
the long run once our security geeks or foil hats as jrandom calls them
are done, but the interface is the same problem.

Each gateway machine in or out of i2p is a possible target for
organizations which don't hold i2p's values close to their hearts like
many of us do!  Are we to have specific machines/nodes which will
volunteer to be a gateway?  Should every machine/node be a gateway if
it is addressable?  How many nodes does i2p need before it would
generally not be profitable for an organization to coerce individuals
just because they were involved with some project which might
be considered subversive?  If one were to have specific volunteer
gateways who in their right minds might volunteer for that position
knowing they are opening themselves for all sorts of persecution.

How affective would it be for us to do IP spoofing on outgoing
connections?  I am sure there are many routers which wouldn't pass
traffic which didn't have originating IP addresses in it's address
range but if one could have nodes which would have access to routers
designed to handle more general traffic on large network segments then
anonymity might be obtained in that case.  It seems to me you would
also want to modify MAC addresses on those machines.  On larger public
segments such as cable one might also be able to do spoofing within
the hosting organizations allocated address space.  Has anyone
considered the possibility of routing via MAC addresses?  It seems
their advantage is that they do not group together into address space
such as say a class 'c' address range which can easily be filtered and
tracked providing more anonymity if spoofed.

A problem with incoming traffic is domain naming.  When we mail
someone, we send to their specific email address, if we were to use mail
gateways for example it may prove cumbersome to propagate lists of
gateways which folks could remember when sending to friends in i2p.

Maybe this has all been hashed over before I didn't find anything I
found to useful on a casual search but I may have been looking for the
wrong thing.  I don't mean to sound negative either because I really
am not.  I believe these issues need some type of solution in
preparation for the time when i2p is fully deployed.  I also know that
I do not have the necessary education to make these questions into a
trivial bump in the road.  I hope that others do though so that we
might get on with developing whatever trivial processes will provide
the solutions.


Well that's it then, colour me gone!
i2p mailing list
i2p at i2p.net

----- End forwarded message -----
Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a>
ICBM: 48.07078, 11.61144            http://www.leitl.org
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http://moleculardevices.org         http://nanomachines.net
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