[linux-elitists] How about a fork of Jessie without systemd?

Rick Moen rick at linuxmafia.com
Sun Aug 2 21:35:19 PDT 2015

FWIW, in looking through /var/lib/apt/lists/*Packages files for direct
dependencies on package systemd, they seem extremely rare -- details
below.  There are many direct dependencies on libsystemd0, but that
should not bother anyone but the rabid, concerned about infection of
their systems by systemd's homeopathic essence even in the absence of
systemd itself.  ;->

Quoting Marc MERLIN (marc at merlins.org):

> It's not that simple.
> Many new packages will just not install because even though they don't
> depend on systemd, they pick up systemd as a dep through automatic
> dependency generation.

I'm guessing you mean the sysadmin requested package A, A has a Depends
for package B, B has a Depends for package systemd (or some longer but
similar chain that reaches systemd).  Correct?

Jessie x86_64 currently has:
Depends on 'systemd-shim' but not systemd:  1  (init-select)
Depends on 'systemd-shim | systemd-sysv' but not systemd:  1 (xfce4-session)
Depends on 'netbase | systemd-sysv' but not systemd:  1 (gpsd)
Depends on 'systemd-sysv' but not systemd:  1 (systemd-cron)
Depends on 'systemd-ui' but not systemd:  1 (systemd-gui)
Depends on 'systemd | consolekit':  2 (mate-power-manager, solaar)
Depends on 'systemd | sysvinit':  1 (libguestfs0)
Depends on 'tmpreaper | systemd':  1 (sogo)
Depends on 'lsb-base | systemd':  1 (ligthttpd)
Depends on 'consolekit | upower | systemd':  1 (lxsession)
Depends on 'systemd' (with or without version qualfiers):  14

The 14 package with a direct dependency on package systemd are:
debian-installer (and nine other debian-installer* variants),
live-config-systemd, libpam-systemd, systemd-dbg, systemd-sysv.

Anyway, please detail the 'automatic dependency generation' scenario 
you're contemplating, if/when you have time -- because I'm having a
difficult time envisioning a chain of Depends involving any of those
14 on my non-GNOME, non-NetworkManager systems.[1]  I trust you're not
talking about Recommends, as automatic installation of Recommends
packages can be readily suppressed via lines like these in
/etc/apt.con.d/* :

APT::Install-Recommends "0";
APT::Install-Suggests "0";

(Second of those hasn't been needed, but is just in case.)

[1] Closest to problematic in that regard, it seems to me, as
libpam-systemd.  Here are the packages that depend on that package:
gdm3, gnome-bluetooth, gnome-settings-daemon, network-manager,
policykit-1, udisks2, wmshutdown.  (Package lightdm requires either
libpam-systemd or consolekit.)  No surprise that GNOME and
NetworkManager are horrendous dependency hairballs, but that's an
obvious cue for the 'Doctor, it _hurts_ when I do this!' joke.

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