[linux-elitists] Arson vs. DoS WAS: The hairball speaks

Rob Walker rob@myinternetplace.net
Tue Sep 9 23:28:22 PDT 2003


On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 22:04, Dan Wilder wrote:

> So what's the qualitative difference between covert DOS attacks and, 
> say, setting the CEO's back screen door on fire with lighter fluid or 
> for that matter just burning down the headquarters?


In AZ, at least 8 years ago, arson was enough to justify deadly force to
prevent.  The logic was that the preventer would be right in thinking
there was someone inside the structure, and in so using deadly force,
they would be preventing the harm of a third party.

>From http://www.ci.mesa.az.us/police/literature/useforce.asp :

8. QUESTION: Tell me about the third situation, which is the use of
force to prevent crimes. 
ANSWER: The law allows you to use the minimum amount of force you
reasonably believe is immediately necessary to prevent or stop eight
different crimes. They are:

....


 (7) Arson (burning) of an occupied structure;


and from http://www.azleg.state.az.us/legtext/44leg/2r/bills/hb2366p.htm

13-403. Justification; use of physical force in defense of a person

...

B. A PERSON MAY USE DEADLY PHYSICAL FORCE ONLY IF THE PERSON REASONABLY
BELIEVES THAT A LESSER DEGREE OF FORCE IS INADEQUATE AND THAT EITHER: 

1. THE PERSON HAS REASONABLE GROUNDS TO BELIEVE THAT HE OR ANOTHER
PERSON IS IN IMMINENT DANGER OF DEATH OR SERIOUS PHYSICAL INJURY. 


and the same source:



13-405. Justification; use of physical force in defense of premises

...

B. A PERSON MAY USE DEADLY FORCE UNDER THIS SECTION ONLY IN DEFENSE OF
HIMSELF OR ANOTHER PERSON PURSUANT TO SECTION 13-403 OR WHEN THE PERSON
REASONABLY BELIEVES THAT DEADLY FORCE IS NECESSARY TO PREVENT WHAT THE
PERSON REASONABLY BELIEVES TO BE AN ATTEMPT BY THE TRESPASSER TO COMMIT
ARSON.



And in the training that I was given, it was made quite clear that some
people might think that arson was always an attack on an unknown person
unless you _knew_ that the structure was empty.

I think that in Arizona, there is a signifigant difference between arson
and DoS attacks.  I don't know about Utah.

rob



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